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Oilers are not buying anyone out. Why would they? They are going to field a somewhat competitive team. Then next year they will trim the dead weight a bit more and come out hard in the new arena.

Edited by Dooyas

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I'm not surprised or unhappy with this outcome.  I'm curious to see if/who the Oilers buyout.  The smart money's on Nikitin.

I'm not surprised or unhappy with the Schultz signing either, and not even all that curious about the buyout (who). I'm more curious why they want to do a buyout, because as near as I can see we don't need the cap room with the existing roster, so buying anyone out (effectively passing some of their cap hit from this year to next year(s) cap) must mean that more moves are coming. What those move(s) are is what has me curious :)

 

Giving Schultz a qualifying offer, taking him to club elected arbitration, signing him for more than the qualifying offer before arbitration, subsequently buying someone out this year, all only make sense (to me) if they are part of a bigger plan.....for this year. I like the strategy and hope it works for the better of the team, but I'm baffled trying to guess the end result :D

 

 

They would look at the buyout to get rid of a contract rather than the cap space. The Oilers can have a maximum of 23 roster contracts on opening day. If opening day were tomorrow, the Oilers have are at the limit for roster contracts (players with one way contracts). By buying out Nikitin (and his one way contract), the Oilers can make room for someone else. Because Nikitin isn't on the books long-term, the preference (assumption) would be to trade him and retain his salary.

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An article on the main Oilers page says that after 3 years Schultz has decided he should get stronger & develope an edge. :th_shrug:

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Im all for giving him a shot with the new coaching regime.The guys got something to prove and has shown some incredible talent in the past.You don't lead the AHL in points ,as a defenceman to boot, without some amazing offensive skill..Lets not forget a college career that had 30 teams courting him as a UFA.The past is the past,its the future that counts...Congrats on the signing Justin !!!

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Im very pleased with this signing and looking forward to watching him score at least 20 goals next year when he is "let off his leash". This kid is a sniper, and a very smart hockey player. He's been waiting in the weeds-"so to speak". Smart because he hasn't gotten seriously injured over the past however many years playing on a basement dwelling team with a terrible system. One of the strongest and quickest backwards skaters I've ever seen. Looks like he gets bigger every year too. Giving him a raise now will hopefully ensure his loyalty to resign with us after he breaks out next year, scores 26 goals, and wins the Norris trophy-(hopefully playing paired with a rookie! Nurse.) Believe it. I'd buyout Ferrence if they think they should. Nikitin may have a bounce back year within a good system..Make him earn his 3 milli.

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I'm not sure why people are now expressing their disagreement with the signing?  Justin Schultz was guaranteed to be re-signed the minute the Oilers tabled his qualifying offer, over two weeks ago.

 

This is the best case scenario, in my opinion. 

 

By opening the arbitration process, another buyout window is now available (which I suspect was the impetus behind the decision to begin with).  By agreeing to terms prior to the arbitration proceedings they have negated the player option of a 2 year extension as well as the likelihood that he is awarded more than the $3.9M.

 

I've said it from the start, this case wasn't going to arbitration (few ever do).  I'm still of the opinion that Schultz and his agent were "playing ball" with the club by not accepting the QO and allowing the arbitration process to trigger a second buyout window.

 

I'm not surprised or unhappy with this outcome.  I'm curious to see if/who the Oilers buyout.  The smart money's on Nikitin.

Qualifying him does NOT guarantee the Oilers were stuck with him, it just meant if someone (foolishly) signed him to an offer sheet, we could still reap some type of compensation. I saw it as a shrewd move by an intelligent GM.

Filing for arbitration, however, is what guaranteed he'd be an Oiler. But I still would have taken him all the way to the arbitrator, because you can't tell me he's worth more than 85% of his salary, not with much better defensemen (Johnny O, Victor Hedman, Jake Muzzin, Roman Josi, MARK FAYNE anyone?) at similar or lower prices.

Nope. I said in the beginning I'd rather just walk away. Qualifying him was alright, because at least he wasn't getting a raise. His call whether or not to try again or sit on the couch for a season. Signing him to a $3.9M contract is ludicrous.

The one thing you mention that I have to agree with is at least he didn't get the option for two years. As FF52 said, perhaps that's the mentality with settling prior. I don't believe for a second he'd get any more from the arbitrator than he already signed for though.

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Maybe they gave him the extra $ so he can be traded to a team trying to reach the cap floor.  JS must realize that this is his last chance here.

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Jultz can never again be taken to arbitration by any club.

 

As far as I can tell, the second buy out window opens Saturday, and will remain open for 48 hours.  I don't know if landing on a weekend effects this, nor do I know what time of day it opens. 

 

Not sure what to make of this signing yet.

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Jultz can never again be taken to arbitration by any club.

 

As far as I can tell, the second buy out window opens Saturday, and will remain open for 48 hours.  I don't know if landing on a weekend effects this, nor do I know what time of day it opens. 

 

Not sure what to make of this signing yet.

He wasn't actually taken to arbitration.  The settlement was reached before the hearing.  Doesn't this effect that rule somewhat?

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Nope.  Article 12.3©

 

"a Player as to whom a Club has elected salary arbitration, regardless of whether a hearing took place in connection with that election, is no longer eligible for Club-elected salary arbitration." 

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Nope.  Article 12.3©

 

"a Player as to whom a Club has elected salary arbitration, regardless of whether a hearing took place in connection with that election, is no longer eligible for Club-elected salary arbitration." 

NHL/NHLPA CBA is one convoluted, strange contract.

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Nocchi you are amazing.  You are truly our resident rulebook encyclopedia.  Whenever we need to know a rule or get clarification on it, you are the one that comes to the rescue.  Our go to guy.  We are but the sheep and you are the shephard!

 

:lol:

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This JS business is getting confusing on several fronts:

1. The oilers request arbitration, presumably with the purpose of opening a buy-out window only, since JS was given a raise (no intent to challenge his contract amount).

2. Because of the arbitration process, we can't trade JS in 2015-16.

So, regardless of buy-out windows, what exactly did the team gain vis-a-vis JS...aren't they worse off now? If I didn't know better, it looks like a piece of MacT's work here.

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bronco: if I'm the shepherd, you're all in trouble ^__^

 

Rapier:  I still can't find anything stating we can't trade Schultz.  I've seen people state that, but can't find anything in the CBA that actually says that.  Not sayin' you're incorrect, just that I can't find that rule, and would like clarification, as people are definitely getting that from somewhere. 

 

From what I can tell, we could trade him tomorrow if we were so inclined.

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bronco: if I'm the shepherd, you're all in trouble ^__^

 

Rapier:  I still can't find anything stating we can't trade Schultz.  I've seen people state that, but can't find anything in the CBA that actually says that.  Not sayin' you're incorrect, just that I can't find that rule, and would like clarification, as people are definitely getting that from somewhere. 

 

From what I can tell, we could trade him tomorrow if we were so inclined.

Yup, I don't think there are any restrictions to trading him once he has signed a contract. I am pretty sure it just becomes a contract like any other.

Edited by IGibb

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I think the no trading rule is with offer sheets on restricted free agents. If you are successful with an offer sheet you can't trade them for a year or 2

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After a quick glance at the CBA, my eyes glazed over pretty quickly. However, there was no mention of trades / restrictions arising from arbitration, so it appears to be a non-issue.

Sorry for raising a red - herring.

Edited by RapierShot

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Now that schultz has a new contract (for about .5-1m too much) and most people love to hate on him. What would he have to do this year for people to want to resign him next year? What is the min that you would like to see from him? Do you think he can do it?

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Now that schultz has a new contract (for about .5-1m too much) and most people love to hate on him. What would he have to do this year for people to want to resign him next year? What is the min that you would like to see from him? Do you think he can do it?

.5-1m too much more like 3.9 too much for the oilers. Schultz has fallen into S. Gagner territory for me, sorry to be of no help but there's not a single thing at this point that will alter my view.

I really see no need for him, McDavid, Nuge, Yak, Eberle, Hall, and Pouliot should all be capable of getting enough points that Schultz is not required, we need to find a way to prevent goals not allow them.

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Schultz has been resigned for $3.9M. It's still too much for him imo, but I'm fine with it. On the bright side, it's a 1-year "show me" deal & not a long term deal. For Schultz, it's make it or break it. He has a lot to prove if he wants to be a part of the Oilers roster after this year.

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Now that schultz has a new contract (for about .5-1m too much) and most people love to hate on him. What would he have to do this year for people to want to resign him next year? What is the min that you would like to see from him? Do you think he can do it?

I'd like to see him take the puck from Kopitar, Getlaf, Benn, etc...and, no, I don't think he can do it

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1 year 3.9 million. Just signed this morning.

 

That's a bit of a head scratcher. By the team electing to go to arbitration, they were able to offer as low as 85% of the current salary, which would have made an offer of just over $3.12 million. To me, the decision of the team elected arbitration is because they don't think they are getting fair value on the existing contract (i.e. the player isn't worth what he's being paid), which in this case was $3.675 million.

 

To settle at a new contract before arbitration for a $225,000 raise makes me wonder if there's another strategy in place. I don't think there was a high interest in Justin from other teams on a one year $3.675 million contract, and I'd expect there would be even less at a one year $3.9 million hit.

 

At the time of his signing, a lot of fans were on MacT about the one year deal for Schultz. In this instance, I'm very happy the Oilers only offered him a single year deal. I just can't fathom the logic behind the raise.

 

 

 

Some are saying if he produces and flourishes this year under TM?  JS could be in for a good raise next year, somewhere in the 5 x $5 mill range.... :th_hockey20player: . 

 

 

If the Oiler's truly believed Justin will flourish and produce under McLellan and become a solid, reliable defenseman, they would have signed him to a 5 year x $4 million deal and Schultz would have been all over it. A one year deal says that the Oilers are willing to give him a chance to prove himself, but are not confident enough to give him multiple chances season after season.

 

To me this signing says that one of either Nurse/Reinhart plays in the AHL this season. Having even one of them on the roster still involves a Nikitin buyout or trade.

 

Fayne, Ference, Gryba, Klefbom, Schultz and Sekera all have one way contracts, leaving the 7th spot open for Nikitin/Nurse/Reinhart.

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  I am fine with the signing as that is not an unrealistic amount for a guy who will be slotted in as a second pairing dman. Its the term that makes it a success. Lets also include that yes, even with 97, we are always going to have to overpay players to live or play in Edmonton. That is just reality.

 

 I have some concerns about JS defensive abilities, or lack of them, to ever play a meaningful role at this level.  Any dman who puts up over .50 PPG on a really bad team in his rookie year should get a least some time under  a legit NHL coach to either sink or swim. Either way he either shows improvement or we move him for a bag of pucks at the deadline and have zero cap issues in the future.

 

 No need for the full tilt panic level yet again displayed here by the same few as the sky is not falling with a one year contract.

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The Biggest problem with this contract is that it is far too high to afford to NOT play him. It guarantees him a roster spot without earning it, and makes him untradable if he continues to perform as he has. He will be in the NHL, on the Oilers this season, in the lineup, every game regardless of how he plays (unless the Oilers are willing to pay someone 4 million to play in the AHL again ala Sheldon Souray).

This is NOT a successful recipe for proper development. His improvement to live up to that contract has to be nothing short of remarkable, to go from being a top 50 defence scoring leader to being top 10 minimum, or baring that, to become a battler in his own zone against players with track records of driving the net hard (like Fog has pointed out), in other words he needs to become a scoring Dynamo or a solid defender. Being a solid defender is not in him. Developing "an edge" as he says he is trying to do, is not a summer "to do list" possibility. It's a life time experience thing. Becoming a top scorer in a league that moves too fast for him, against players who are too tough and hard for him, is also extremely unlikely.

He has skill. No doubt. IMO he doesn't have the mental toughness to convert that skill at the NHL level ...... Welcome to the world of thousands of career minor leaguers ..... The list of offensive defence men that have washed out of the league for the same reason is very, very long.

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Now that schultz has a new contract (for about .5-1m too much) and most people love to hate on him. What would he have to do this year for people to want to resign him next year? What is the min that you would like to see from him? Do you think he can do it?

I'd like to see him take the puck from Kopitar, Getlaf, Benn, etc...and, no, I don't think he can do it

Yes he can!....All he needs to do is chop those guys with a solid slash on the ankle or arm, just like a player I use to play with use to do! He was small but wasn't afraid of anybody. Opposition players were afraid to go on his side, If they did, he would make them pay! I heard Schultz will be doing that this year! We wait and see...

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The Biggest problem with this contract is that it is far too high to afford to NOT play him. It guarantees him a roster spot without earning it, and makes him untradable if he continues to perform as he has. He will be in the NHL, on the Oilers this season, in the lineup, every game regardless of how he plays (unless the Oilers are willing to pay someone 4 million to play in the AHL again ala Sheldon Souray).

This is NOT a successful recipe for proper development. His improvement to live up to that contract has to be nothing short of remarkable, to go from being a top 50 defence scoring leader to being top 10 minimum, or baring that, to become a battler in his own zone against players with track records of driving the net hard (like Fog has pointed out), in other words he needs to become a scoring Dynamo or a solid defender. Being a solid defender is not in him. Developing "an edge" as he says he is trying to do, is not a summer "to do list" possibility. It's a life time experience thing. Becoming a top scorer in a league that moves too fast for him, against players who are too tough and hard for him, is also extremely unlikely.

He has skill. No doubt. IMO he doesn't have the mental toughness to convert that skill at the NHL level ...... Welcome to the world of thousands of career minor leaguers ..... The list of offensive defence men that have washed out of the league for the same reason is very, very long.

Or as Windsor would put it, "Same old Oilers"

At least in regards to Schultz. I've been on record as saying he didn't even deserve the QO, but I'm not paid to make these decisions and PC is. Let's see what TM can do with Schultz, and see if he FINALLY man's up.

If he suddenly becomes a smart, reliable player in his own zone I'll be happy for him, and wouldn't be opposed to keeping him after this season. But for me, he didn't earn this shot to prove himself, as he's failed twice now already.

Unless he wants to play wing?

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Again, I get the negativity. But Schultz would hardly be unique either way. Chances are, as Deutsch suggests, he may never get it and sink.

 

But sometimes a lot of this reminds me of how a lot of Bolts fans were divided over Hedman. Big yet soft, not physical, no intensity, doesn't get it, can't put it together, what a bust, what a waste of #2 overall. ...

 

Maybe Schultz needs a little more time with a proper coach to start turning it around. I'd really hate it if we gave him away for pennies only to watch him blossom on another team, and for me that's entirely in the realm of the possible. But so is going bust.

 

Good thing it's only 1 year eh? Justin has talked a good talk so far, saying the right things. He has one year to walk the walk. Let's see how he does with this last chance.

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Again, I get the negativity. But Schultz would hardly be unique either way. Chances are, as Deutsch suggests, he may never get it and sink.

 

But sometimes a lot of this reminds me of how a lot of Bolts fans were divided over Hedman. Big yet soft, not physical, no intensity, doesn't get it, can't put it together, what a bust, what a waste of #2 overall. ...

 

Maybe Schultz needs a little more time with a proper coach to start turning it around. I'd really hate it if we gave him away for pennies only to watch him blossom on another team, and for me that's entirely in the realm of the possible. But so is going bust.

 

Good thing it's only 1 year eh? Justin has talked a good talk so far, saying the right things. He has one year to walk the walk. Let's see how he does with this last chance.

I would agree if not for the fact that he Lindross'd Anaheim and we signed him for free. No loss of an asset, so I'd still have walked away. I get that he could become a good defender, and really I hope so for his sake. But we can't afford to let him learn on the fly costing us GA and points in the standings.

(I do know Schultz himself wasn't THE problem, but he is A problem, the allowing an underachiever to continually get kicks at the can is another)

ETA - I would also like to point out that Schultz never saw a dip in icetime, regardless of play. That needs to stop immediately, and if he bags it, waive him to the minors.

Edited by Warehammer

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