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David2Dave

Possible Trades?

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22 minutes ago, Fogolin2 said:

I like Bouchard too, but he doesn't win us a Cup with a decent supporting cast. McDavid could do that. If Bouchard can get us a real good NHLer for the next 4 years, I would be willing (hesitant, but willing) move him.

The interesting thing is there will be a lot of competition for Bouchard . There's Bear , Berglund , Persson , Jones & Lagesson can both play on the right side , any one of then could be trade bait ….. It won't be handed to Bouchard ,  which can only be a good thing .

So definitely , if Bouchard was part of a trade that could get a real good NHler winger for the next four years to play in the top six  . Why not ? They have plenty of young RHD options available .

Sekera is going to be a factor as well . He could be the veteran capable of guiding a young Dman . He sure had a glowing report on Lagesson while they were paired together in Bakersfield . We have a lot to look forward to ,  next season will be even more interesting than what this season has proven to be .

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39 minutes ago, billpayor said:

The interesting thing is there will be a lot of competition for Bouchard . There's Bear , Berglund , Persson , Jones & Lagesson can both play on the right side , any one of then could be trade bait ….. It won't be handed to Bouchard ,  which can only be a good thing .

So definitely , if Bouchard was part of a trade that could get a real good NHler winger for the next four years to play in the top six  . Why not ? They have plenty of young RHD options available .

Sekera is going to be a factor as well . He could be the veteran capable of guiding a young Dman . He sure had a glowing report on Lagesson while they were paired together in Bakersfield . We have a lot to look forward to ,  next season will be even more interesting than what this season has proven to be .

I assume that Sekera's career is over before his contract expires.

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2 hours ago, billpayor said:

You can't count him out yet .

A 32 year old 'mobile' dman, with 2 debilitating leg injuries in consecutive seasons. I'm not counting on him for anything.

Having said that, I'd kinda given up on Klefbom, and he proved me WAY wrong this year.

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1 minute ago, Fogolin2 said:

A 32 year old 'mobile' dman, with 2 debilitating leg injuries in consecutive seasons. I'm not counting on him for anything.

Having said that, I'd kinda given up on Klefbom, and he proved me WAY wrong this year.

it's good to see you agree you have been wrong in the past .

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21 hours ago, Fogolin2 said:

I like Bouchard too, but he doesn't win us a Cup with a decent supporting cast. McDavid could do that. If Bouchard can get us a real good NHLer for the next 4 years, I would be willing (hesitant, but willing) move him.

That trade is based on flawed logic.  The first piece of flawed logic is that McDavid is going to go to management and demand a trade in the next couple of years. This is pure speculation at best and a very remote possibility at the moment. At this time there is no need for this "Hail Mary" type of trade. The second piece of flawed logic is that we can't have both McDavid and Bouchard with a decent supporting cast that will win a cup, yes we can. 

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22 minutes ago, mrtea said:

That trade is based on flawed logic.  The first piece of flawed logic is that McDavid is going to go to management and demand a trade in the next couple of years. This is pure speculation at best and a very remote possibility at the moment. At this time there is no need for this "Hail Mary" type of trade. The second piece of flawed logic is that we can't have both McDavid and Bouchard with a decent supporting cast that will win a cup, yes we can. 

Waiting while the McDavid meter is running is flawed logic. And nowhere did I say that Bouchard couldn't be on a Cup team with McD. I'm saying that trading Bouchard and the 1st rounder could make that Cup team happen a lot sooner.

And, you dismissing the possibility of McDavid asking out of this crap show is your own hopeful wishful thinking. You have no idea how remote or how real the possibility is, and neither do I, but it can't be dismissed as a "very remote possibility at the moment". I'm sure he won't do it with Gene between periods, but I see his frustration and the team is currently going backwards, in his 4th year.

 

I'm saying to get the "supporting cast" that we need, we'll have to either;

a) Give up valuable assets to get those difference makers sooner

b) Wait another couple-few years for our prospects to pan out

If we trade the picks/prospects for good players we'll have known quantities playing with McDavid sooner, and for more of his window. We've seen lots of sure-thing prospects turn into nothing before they made the show, if they ever made it. Lots can happen along the way.

 

It's all very logical.

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2 hours ago, Fogolin2 said:

Waiting while the McDavid meter is running is flawed logic. And nowhere did I say that Bouchard couldn't be on a Cup team with McD. I'm saying that trading Bouchard and the 1st rounder could make that Cup team happen a lot sooner.

And, you dismissing the possibility of McDavid asking out of this crap show is your own hopeful wishful thinking. You have no idea how remote or how real the possibility is, and neither do I, but it can't be dismissed as a "very remote possibility at the moment". I'm sure he won't do it with Gene between periods, but I see his frustration and the team is currently going backwards, in his 4th year.

 

I'm saying to get the "supporting cast" that we need, we'll have to either;

a) Give up valuable assets to get those difference makers sooner

b) Wait another couple-few years for our prospects to pan out

If we trade the picks/prospects for good players we'll have known quantities playing with McDavid sooner, and for more of his window. We've seen lots of sure-thing prospects turn into nothing before they made the show, if they ever made it. Lots can happen along the way.

 

It's all very logical.

Running out the "McDavid meter" has never been a good idea to me. I have always stated that I was for a major trade that would bring in stability to the backend. I believe that foundation will help to check off two problems, defense and offense. The offense created as a bi product from a defense that is able to transition the puck, instead of chasing around our own end. Our current defense is playing over there heads by trying to fill a top pairing spot that we just don't have. Klefbom has progressed really well and has played the top spot pretty well, but he just isn't good enough at the moment. If you add one top defender from around the league that we all would agree is an upgrade is all it would take to really improve this team. All the sudden you have" X"  added to the defense pushing everyone else down a spot and adding veteran experience and leadership to draw from.  Sekera coming back will not feel quite as much burden so he can focus on recovering his game. You have Klefbom with a little less pressure so he can focus on maturing his game. Nurse is in the same boat where he keeps getting better and this also helps his game from mentorship. Larsson would improve mostly by having the weight off his shoulders and moving down one spot where he should be.  Bouchard is coming in and now he can rise up naturally as he progresses. Now we can actually look at our defense and have trading assets not named Bouchard.

Forget about trading Bouchard but I'm very open to trading our 1st and anyone not named McDavid or you know, because we do need to shake things up to make "that cup team happen sooner". I believe that one big trade to get our defense upgrade will make a huge improvement to the whole team. One move can fix our broken D and then we can focus on wingers or whatever. Next season we can see who graduates from the AHL to the NHL and that can have a huge impact on our team. We are definitely a broken team now, but a few good moves could make a world of difference. 

So...... there is no need for Conner to request a trade. I am not dismissing the possibility of McDavid wanting out but I am saying it is remote if the new GM takes his time and makes the right moves, or necessary moves to improve "this crap show".

To get our "supporting cast" I think we need to do both A and B. We need to give up valuable assets to get those difference makers and we need to wait while our prospects pan out. Whatever assets we use up of our prospects will not eliminate all our prospects, we will still have many to develop. There's another draft not far off, we'll always have prospects coming in. The trick is picking the right or best ones.

I also believe there are other options we have not even touched on, because that will be the job of our next GM and I hope we finally get a good one. How's that for logic Spocky boy ?    

Edited by mrtea

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10 minutes ago, mrtea said:

Running out the "McDavid meter" has never been a good idea to me. I have always stated that I was for a major trade that would bring in stability to the backend. I believe that foundation will help to check off two problems, defense and offense. The offense created as a bi product from a defense that is able to transition the puck, instead of chasing around our own end. Our current defense is playing over there heads by trying to fill a top pairing spot that we just don't have. Klefbom has progressed really well and has played the top spot pretty well, but he just isn't good enough at the moment. If you add one top defender from around the league that we all would agree is an upgrade is all it would take to really improve this team. All the sudden you have" X"  added to the defense pushing everyone else down a spot and adding veteran experience and leadership to draw from.  Sekera coming back will not feel quite as much burden so he can focus on recovering his game. You have Klefbom with a little less pressure so he can focus on maturing his game. Nurse is in the same boat where he keeps getting better and this also helps his game from mentorship. Larsson would improve mostly by having the weight off his shoulders and moving down one spot where he should be.  Bouchard is coming in and now he can rise up naturally as he progresses. Now we can actually look at our defense and have trading assets not named Bouchard.

Forget about trading Bouchard but I'm very open to trading our 1st and anyone not named McDavid or you know, because we do need to shake things up to make "that cup team happen sooner". I believe that one big trade to get our defense upgrade will make a huge improvement to the whole team. One move can fix our broken D and then we can focus on wingers or whatever. Next season we can see who graduates from the AHL to the NHL and that can have a huge impact on our team. We are definitely a broken team now, but a few good moves could make a world of difference. 

So...... there is no need for Conner to request a trade. I am not dismissing the possibility of McDavid wanting out but I am saying it is remote if the new GM takes his time and makes the right moves, or necessary moves to improve "this crap show".

To get our "supporting cast" I think we need to do both A and B. We need to give up valuable assets to get those difference makers and we need to wait while our prospects pan out. Whatever assets we use up of our prospects will not eliminate all our prospects, we will still have many to develop. There's another draft not far off, we'll always have prospects coming in. The trick is picking the right or best ones.

I also believe there are other options we have not even touched on, because that will be the job of our next GM and I hope we finally get a good one. How's that for logic Spocky boy ?    

Only thing illogical about this is your man crush for Bouchard. We've had lots of players picked 10th or higher that have provided nothing. Heck, I've been a huge Nurse guy ever since we drafted him at #7, and I often wonder what some of those offers that we turned down would've been. Maybe we'd be better off, maybe we'd have the guy you're describing. Nothing ventured, nothing gained. I think Bouchard is another full year away, at least. If his return is a real proven NHLer, like you described, we'd be better sooner and quit wasting McDavid time.

Live long and prosper, homie.

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10 minutes ago, Fogolin2 said:

Only thing illogical about this is your man crush for Bouchard. We've had lots of players picked 10th or higher that have provided nothing. Heck, I've been a huge Nurse guy ever since we drafted him at #7, and I often wonder what some of those offers that we turned down would've been. Maybe we'd be better off, maybe we'd have the guy you're describing. Nothing ventured, nothing gained. I think Bouchard is another full year away, at least. If his return is a real proven NHLer, like you described, we'd be better sooner and quit wasting McDavid time.

Live long and prosper, homie.

I will stand by my opinion that Bouchard is by far the best D prospect we have had since Coffey. I hope you can admit it when you realize you were wrong that it would be a good idea to trade Bouchard.

P.S.  By the way, I don't appreciate how you are trying to diminish my argument by insinuating I have a man crush on Bouchard. Grow up, when you say something not so brilliant and get called on it don't start acting gradeschoolish. 

And my big brother can beat your big brother anyway! ( Sorry, got carried away again.) 

Edited by mrtea

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14 minutes ago, mrtea said:

I will stand by my opinion that Bouchard is by far the best D prospect we have had since Coffey. I hope you can admit it when you realize you were wrong that it would be a good idea to trade Bouchard. 

It's just an idea at a certain point in time. It can't really be right or wrong. I'm not saying that we should or we shouldn't. I'm saying I'm open to any way the team can get better.

If we'd trade him for a big name player, maybe it wouldn't work out. If we keep him and he becomes a 50 point 2way guy, that doesn't mean that we couldn't have got a better team by trading him....see what I mean? What if one of our rivals has the perfect matchup for him? Us vs the Stars for all those years. Regher never looked as good against anyone as he did against Hemsky, and there was nothing Hemsky or the Oilers could do about it. We couldn't beat Minnesota for 10 years....it's a fluid competition. The only players that are pillars that the league changes around are guys like Crosby, McDavid, etc...

it isn't cut and dried as logic. Too many variables.

Edited by Fogolin2

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33 minutes ago, mrtea said:

P.S.  By the way, I don't appreciate how you are trying to diminish my argument by insinuating I have a man crush on Bouchard. Grow up, when you say something not so brilliant and get called on it don't start acting gradeschoolish. 

And my big brother can beat your big brother anyway! ( Sorry, got carried away again.) 

I don't mean to be dismissive, but we've seen so many Shiny New Toys, Saviors, and whatever else they've been called, and way more of them turned out to be average (or, above average for some other team). Outside of McDavid, there is no untradeable player in our system.

Looking at Pittsburgh right now. Pragmatically. No way Crosby is the problem, but he could sure be the solution for the right price. 

I just don't get attached to players, as they are a commodity, like flour, butter, eggs, sugar, chocolate chips....somebody still has to bake the cookie. And, don't overcook it!

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2 hours ago, mrtea said:

Running out the "McDavid meter" has never been a good idea to me. I have always stated that I was for a major trade that would bring in stability to the backend. I believe that foundation will help to check off two problems, defense and offense. The offense created as a bi product from a defense that is able to transition the puck, instead of chasing around our own end. Our current defense is playing over there heads by trying to fill a top pairing spot that we just don't have. Klefbom has progressed really well and has played the top spot pretty well, but he just isn't good enough at the moment. If you add one top defender from around the league that we all would agree is an upgrade is all it would take to really improve this team. All the sudden you have" X"  added to the defense pushing everyone else down a spot and adding veteran experience and leadership to draw from.  Sekera coming back will not feel quite as much burden so he can focus on recovering his game. You have Klefbom with a little less pressure so he can focus on maturing his game. Nurse is in the same boat where he keeps getting better and this also helps his game from mentorship. Larsson would improve mostly by having the weight off his shoulders and moving down one spot where he should be.  Bouchard is coming in and now he can rise up naturally as he progresses. Now we can actually look at our defense and have trading assets not named Bouchard.

Forget about trading Bouchard but I'm very open to trading our 1st and anyone not named McDavid or you know, because we do need to shake things up to make "that cup team happen sooner". I believe that one big trade to get our defense upgrade will make a huge improvement to the whole team. One move can fix our broken D and then we can focus on wingers or whatever. Next season we can see who graduates from the AHL to the NHL and that can have a huge impact on our team. We are definitely a broken team now, but a few good moves could make a world of difference. 

So...... there is no need for Conner to request a trade. I am not dismissing the possibility of McDavid wanting out but I am saying it is remote if the new GM takes his time and makes the right moves, or necessary moves to improve "this crap show".

To get our "supporting cast" I think we need to do both A and B. We need to give up valuable assets to get those difference makers and we need to wait while our prospects pan out. Whatever assets we use up of our prospects will not eliminate all our prospects, we will still have many to develop. There's another draft not far off, we'll always have prospects coming in. The trick is picking the right or best ones.

I also believe there are other options we have not even touched on, because that will be the job of our next GM and I hope we finally get a good one. How's that for logic Spocky boy ?    

Makes sense to me, the last time we had a real run at the cup the one name that stood out was Chris Pronger.  

Yes we had some other useful pieces, but the team showed much improvement from earlier years with Pronger in the team, and lets be honest, hasn't looked as good since.  

He was the guy "running the show" and it was a great loss when he left.

I have always thought that in Soccer and Hockey, a team should be built from the back to the front, not the other way.  No good scoring 3 if you let 4 in every game, right?

 As Michael Caine would say, "not a lot of people know that".     Maybe I should write to Katz and point this out to him 😎

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1 hour ago, Blackhawk216 said:

Makes sense to me, the last time we had a real run at the cup the one name that stood out was Chris Pronger.  

Yes we had some other useful pieces, but the team showed much improvement from earlier years with Pronger in the team, and lets be honest, hasn't looked as good since.  

He was the guy "running the show" and it was a great loss when he left.

I have always thought that in Soccer and Hockey, a team should be built from the back to the front, not the other way.  No good scoring 3 if you let 4 in every game, right?

 As Michael Caine would say, "not a lot of people know that".     Maybe I should write to Katz and point this out to him 😎

So from back to front, should we trade Koskinen before his extension and NMC kick in next year? 

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15 hours ago, VirginiaOiler said:

So from back to front, should we trade Koskinen before his extension and NMC kick in next year? 

Don't care either way as I believe the real problems with the team (and have been for a long time) are the players who play in front of whoever our goalie is.

Think about it......Dubnyk awful here, a reasonable success with the Wild, Talbot looked good at the Rangers, not so good here, Broissart, not so good here, lights out at Winnipeg.    Maybe our goalies don't look so good because virtually night after night they are left exposed.

We need to address the defensive mojo of this team, and start by either drafting from the back, or maybe see if we can trade for solid defenders, or if possible look at the RFA or UFA market for said players.

Where has it got us drafting Hall, RNH, Eberle, Yakupov, Drai, JP and Yammo?       If any NHL team should be drafting from the back, it is the Oilers. 

Good defence eventually leads to good offence. 

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28 minutes ago, Messrules11 said:

Smith-Pelly on waivers. Hard worker, 26, just over a mil. Better than most of our bottom 6 guys

After the playoffs he had last year?  Wow, he's the type of guy you want in a deep run.

KG, gogogogogo.  Don't care if he doesn't re-sign - the guy knows how to win, even his presence for a few months will bear fruit.

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Worth picking him up just to flip him for a pick. Obviously Caps making room. Like what Florida is doing with Brassard.

Someone will want him. Let's see how smart our GM is...

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3 hours ago, nocchi said:

After the playoffs he had last year?  Wow, he's the type of guy you want in a deep run.

KG, gogogogogo.  Don't care if he doesn't re-sign - the guy knows how to win, even his presence for a few months will bear fruit.

if it's okee with Nocchi, it's okee with mee

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